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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 16.05.13 20:26, Sean Gillies wrote:<br>
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<div>All,<br>
<br>
How about this for a plan: submit an I-D that deprecates the
old crs object, omits the new proposed crsURN object, and
doesn't otherwise change the <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://geojson.org">geojson.org</a> spec. After it is
submitted, we reexamine the CRS situation in light of comments
we'll (hopefully) get. My hypothesis is that this
compatibility-breaking change doesn't actually break very much
in practice.<br>
<br>
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<br>
I think this would be very good. Requests for comments are a good
thing :-) and there are mayn revisions imagineable: As an example
Fielding, R., Ed. and J. Reschke, Ed., “Hypertext Transfer Protocol
(HTTP/1.1): Message Syntax and Routing”
draft-ietf-httpbis-p1-messaging-22, 23 February 2013.
<a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-httpbis-p1-messaging/">https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-httpbis-p1-messaging/</a>.
Have finished the working group call for comments as of April, 30
and I think there will be a draft-ietf-httpbis-p1-messaging-23
coming up ...<br>
<br>
All the best,<br>
<br>
Stefan.<br>
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<div>As a consequence there will be what looks to a lot of GIS
folks like a gap in the spec. We'll need to be able to live
with the multiple gap-filling measures they'll come up with.
For example, Tim, what's GeoServer going to do to satisfy WFS
requests for GeoJSON in EPSG:27700 (or
urn:ogc:def:epsg::27700)? <br>
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<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
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<div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 11:08 AM, Tim
Schaub <span dir="ltr"><<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:tschaub@opengeo.org" target="_blank">tschaub@opengeo.org</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
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<div class="im"><span
style="color:rgb(31,73,125);font-family:Calibri,sans-serif;font-size:11pt">Tim,
I think the situation that we have at the moment is
better than you describe, but not by much. We have
“allow any CRS and axis order will always be lon/lat
or easting/northing”. We did that to avoid the burden
of carrying around axis order knowledge. But it still
has the burden on needing to know what EPSG:27700, or
whatever, means. Web clients still have to get the
WKT, Proj.4 string, etc, from that id (assuming that
they can work with the result). So we dodged one
bullet, but not the other, arguably more complex, one.</span><br>
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<span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
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<div><br>
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<div>Regarding the bullet dodging, web clients don't
actually have to know squat about EPSG:27700 if they
use GeoJSON and WMS 1.1 - they just have to match
strings to know that they are the same. WMS 1.1
described a rendering service where coordinate order
could be mapped to rendering concepts like "top" and
"left" (well known by web clients who deal with
images). GeoJSON maintained the same - a known
mapping of coordinate order to rendering
orientation. So we very intentionally made GeoJSON
work well with existing rendering services.</div>
<div>
<div class="h5">
<div><br>
</div>
<div> <br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0
0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc
solid;padding-left:1ex">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Here’s
a pull request of mine:</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://github.com/GeoJSONWG/draft-geojson/pull/3"
target="_blank">https://github.com/GeoJSONWG/draft-geojson/pull/3</a></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Martin</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span
style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span></p>
<div style="border:none;border-left:solid blue
1.5pt;padding:0cm 0cm 0cm 4.0pt">
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid
#b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0cm 0cm 0cm">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""
lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span
style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""
lang="EN-US"> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:geojson-bounces@lists.geojson.org"
target="_blank">geojson-bounces@lists.geojson.org</a>
[mailto:<a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:geojson-bounces@lists.geojson.org"
target="_blank">geojson-bounces@lists.geojson.org</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Tim Schaub<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 15 May 2013 05:41<br>
<b>To:</b> <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="mailto:geojson@lists.geojson.org"
target="_blank">geojson@lists.geojson.org</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [GeoJSON] Removing
CRS from GeoJSON</span></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">So as to avoid
hijacking Sean's thread, I'll start
a new one here.</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">I'm in favor of
restricting the allowed coordinate
reference systems for GeoJSON
objects to 1: <span>latitude,
longitude coordinates relative
to an ellispoidal CRS based on
the WGS84 datum.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>I think
the second best alternative
would be to restrict to 2 CRS:
CRS84 or EPGS:3857.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">
</p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>I don't
like the "allow any CRS and let
axis order follow the CRS"
because I think it either
reduces interoperability or
imposes an unreasonable burden
on web clients (I don't know of
a good web service - or really
want to depend on one - that
provides axis order information
for arbitrary CRS URN, and the
table is too big to ask every
client to carry around).</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>I
apologize for having missed
earlier "discussion" [1]. I
haven't dug down to that epoch
in my inbox yet.</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>And I'm
in favor of the proposed RFC to
IETF [2].</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="https://github.com/GeoJSONWG/draft-geojson/pull/2"
target="_blank">https://github.com/GeoJSONWG/draft-geojson/pull/2</a></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">
</p>
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>[1] <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.geojson.org/pipermail/geojson-geojson.org/2013-April/000712.html"
target="_blank">http://lists.geojson.org/pipermail/geojson-geojson.org/2013-April/000712.html</a></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>[2] <a
moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://lists.geojson.org/pipermail/geojson-geojson.org/2013-April/000713.html"
target="_blank">http://lists.geojson.org/pipermail/geojson-geojson.org/2013-April/000713.html</a></span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Tim</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>PS - Do
the build artifacts (xml, txt,
etc) need to be in the repo? If
so, can someone update the
README.md with detail on
building them?</span></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>PPS -
Mildly curious what it means to
be "commented out" as an author.
I do see a comment that suggests
authors should be asked if they
are willing to be authors. Happy
to entertain that question.</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> </p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal">
-- <br>
Tim Schaub<br>
OpenGeo <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://opengeo.org/"
target="_blank">http://opengeo.org/</a><br>
Expert service straight from the
developers.</p>
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<div class="h5"><br>
<br clear="all">
<div><br>
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-- <br>
Tim Schaub<br>
OpenGeo <a moz-do-not-send="true"
href="http://opengeo.org/" target="_blank">http://opengeo.org/</a><br>
Expert service straight from the developers.<br>
</div>
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<br>
<br clear="all">
<br>
-- <br>
Sean Gillies
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